Surgical Meth Machine - Al Jourgensen
Questions and live photos: Stuart Millen
Al Jourgensen is a busy man! On top of touring long time act Ministry and working on numerous other musical ventures, the musician and producer is about to release the debut record for his latest project, Surgical Meth Machine. Recorded by himself and long-time producer Sam D'Ambruoso, like much of his previous work, the new album is full of fast guitars and biting lyrics but also some slower, almost poppy numbers.
Caught in the Mosh managed to find a surprisingly chatty Uncle Al in a very good mood, despite being at the end of a long day of press interviews, and spoke about the new album, playing live and what he considers to be Ministry's best ever show.
The Surgical Meth Machine record comes out in just over a week. Reviews have started to come in. Are you happy with the reaction so far?
Haven’t read a single one! I don’t care. That wasn’t the point of this. I never set out to do an album, never set out to have another band. I just went in and recorded ideas, just as I do every four... about every four months of the year. It’s just me and Sammy (D’Ambrouso) or me and an engineer or someone going into a studio for four months and we record... shit... it’s like being constipated. You’ve got a bunch of ideas and you’ve gotta go take a shit. So you go in and you shit. It’s just a really long shit. It takes like four months and you shit out all your stuff and you’re then ready to get new ideas. So that was our point with this.
I mean, our original point... I remember talking about it last time I was in Australia. Someone interviewed me and I said, you know what we wanna do? We reckon we’re going to go into the studio and try to do the fastest record that a bunch of old, stoned, white people could do. And we attempted to do that and about halfway through the record we failed miserably. So it wasn’t meant to be a record or a band. We were just in there trying to record some fast old white guy stuff. And then we got stoned and finished the record off with shit that just sounded groovy and felt good at the time. But the point is, we didn’t have a band name, we didn’t have a band, we didn’t have any other musicians. We just went in there and did what we usually do, four months out of the year, which is record stuff. And this just happened to be that, like... a bunch of my friends would come by while we were recording for those four months and heard the shit and they went “this shit is dope man! You gotta release it”. So we were like, yeah, yeah, whatever... So we gave them a CD and apparently it got out... the CD got out. And record labels started calling, going “we really want to release this” and we’re like, “we don’t know what the hell it is” and they’re like, “well, we really want to release this”.
And their final question was: do you have a band name? and my final response was NO. So we didn’t know what to do with this stuff either. So we thought about it for a night and me and Sammy discussed it and came up with this Surgical Meth Machine concept because we did the whole album really surgically, in the sense that there were no other musicians outside of... well, Jello hung out here for the weekend, just out of the blue and he sung on a song. The rest of it was me and Sammy. So I took care of all the guitars and basses and Sammy took care of all the drums and samples. And we kinda split on what we wanted to sing about at that point in time. But either way, they were just meant to be ideas of stuff that we could throw on the shelf, as we usually do. Whether it goes to Ministry, RevCo or Lard. Or it might be a new project. So some of the stuff we were doing was like, well, this might actually be a new project... but we had no idea at the time, what we were going to do. So at the end, ummm... people actually paid us money (laughs) for this shit (laughs). To just do demos, of something that I would be doing anyway, for four months of the year.
I do it every single year. Have been for the last ten years. That’s the way I record. I just bulk record ideas then we figure out where it goes later. It’s kinda like the old Marine credo of Kill them all, let god sort them out. That kinda thing. So... We let the record companies sort out what they wanted to do with this but that wasn’t our point. We were just trying to get ideas down. And then next thing we knew, I’ve got someone telling me I’ve gotta go do a video and I’ve gotta come up with artwork and all this other crap that goes along with being on a label (laughs). And here we are. I’m sitting here talking to you and doing press for it and I still not exactly sure why (laughs).
Caught in the Mosh managed to find a surprisingly chatty Uncle Al in a very good mood, despite being at the end of a long day of press interviews, and spoke about the new album, playing live and what he considers to be Ministry's best ever show.
The Surgical Meth Machine record comes out in just over a week. Reviews have started to come in. Are you happy with the reaction so far?
Haven’t read a single one! I don’t care. That wasn’t the point of this. I never set out to do an album, never set out to have another band. I just went in and recorded ideas, just as I do every four... about every four months of the year. It’s just me and Sammy (D’Ambrouso) or me and an engineer or someone going into a studio for four months and we record... shit... it’s like being constipated. You’ve got a bunch of ideas and you’ve gotta go take a shit. So you go in and you shit. It’s just a really long shit. It takes like four months and you shit out all your stuff and you’re then ready to get new ideas. So that was our point with this.
I mean, our original point... I remember talking about it last time I was in Australia. Someone interviewed me and I said, you know what we wanna do? We reckon we’re going to go into the studio and try to do the fastest record that a bunch of old, stoned, white people could do. And we attempted to do that and about halfway through the record we failed miserably. So it wasn’t meant to be a record or a band. We were just in there trying to record some fast old white guy stuff. And then we got stoned and finished the record off with shit that just sounded groovy and felt good at the time. But the point is, we didn’t have a band name, we didn’t have a band, we didn’t have any other musicians. We just went in there and did what we usually do, four months out of the year, which is record stuff. And this just happened to be that, like... a bunch of my friends would come by while we were recording for those four months and heard the shit and they went “this shit is dope man! You gotta release it”. So we were like, yeah, yeah, whatever... So we gave them a CD and apparently it got out... the CD got out. And record labels started calling, going “we really want to release this” and we’re like, “we don’t know what the hell it is” and they’re like, “well, we really want to release this”.
And their final question was: do you have a band name? and my final response was NO. So we didn’t know what to do with this stuff either. So we thought about it for a night and me and Sammy discussed it and came up with this Surgical Meth Machine concept because we did the whole album really surgically, in the sense that there were no other musicians outside of... well, Jello hung out here for the weekend, just out of the blue and he sung on a song. The rest of it was me and Sammy. So I took care of all the guitars and basses and Sammy took care of all the drums and samples. And we kinda split on what we wanted to sing about at that point in time. But either way, they were just meant to be ideas of stuff that we could throw on the shelf, as we usually do. Whether it goes to Ministry, RevCo or Lard. Or it might be a new project. So some of the stuff we were doing was like, well, this might actually be a new project... but we had no idea at the time, what we were going to do. So at the end, ummm... people actually paid us money (laughs) for this shit (laughs). To just do demos, of something that I would be doing anyway, for four months of the year.
I do it every single year. Have been for the last ten years. That’s the way I record. I just bulk record ideas then we figure out where it goes later. It’s kinda like the old Marine credo of Kill them all, let god sort them out. That kinda thing. So... We let the record companies sort out what they wanted to do with this but that wasn’t our point. We were just trying to get ideas down. And then next thing we knew, I’ve got someone telling me I’ve gotta go do a video and I’ve gotta come up with artwork and all this other crap that goes along with being on a label (laughs). And here we are. I’m sitting here talking to you and doing press for it and I still not exactly sure why (laughs).
OK, so you don’t care about reviews. I'd just like to say that I’ve listened to the album a bunch of times and it’s excellent. Great job.
Thanks man! I think the reason it might be good is because it wasn’t supposed to be released or anything! It’s just people being themselves; me and Sammy. We didn’t really care because there wasn’t an agenda to it. We weren’t trying to release it or start a band or anything. It was just like... we were just working on ideas. I think that kind of fun comes through your speakers and the record when you listen to it, knowing that these aren’t just some douchebags with some pre-agenda-ed fashion statement or something. Its just like a couple of old white stoned dudes in the studio. And people seemed to like it. So good for them man. I’m happy for them.
Does that then mean you feel pressured when it comes to releasing Ministry or RevCo or whatever else you’re doing?
They’re already recorded dude! That what I keep telling ya. Every four months I just record a bunch of stuff. And at the end of those four months we go “you know what, that might sound good for a new Ministry direction or something. It sounds like Ministry”. Or “this song is stupid. We should put this on RevCo.” Or “you know what, Jello was here and he really liked this song we were working on, so we’ll put it on the Lard shelf”. So at the end of the day, I’ve got all these shelves full of stuff, at the end of the four months. And we don’t know what to do with them. This is the first time we just took the ideas and were coerced into releasing them as a single item. You know what I’m saying? Usually, that stuff goes to everywhere else... on whatever we feel it suits that particular “brand name”, if you will. So it’s... it’s kinda like an organic multi-corporation. If there’s such a thing. The whole way of recording like that is a paradox, because you are separating things into different... costumes, if you will... for other people. “Oh, that might sound like Ministry. Oh, that might sound like RevCo or whatever”. At the same time, you get some of these gems where we’re like, we don’t know what to do with the stuff. So it just winds up like that. And people hear it and then we release it and all hell breaks loose (laughs).
Right. So you never set out do do this as a two-man band. This is what you do all the time anyway. You just liked what you’d recorded and put it out.
You got it! You got it. That’s basically it. The funny part is it took us literally 40 hours to come up with a name after someone said they wanted to release it. We had absolutely no intention... not only with a band, or a release or a record contract or press or videos or anything like that. So we’re kind a like... we’re locked-in rock stars on this one man (laughs). Sorry (laughs). I wish I could give you a better story (laughs). That’s pretty much what happened.
You mentioned the name Surgical Meth Machine while you were in Australia early last year. So the idea had been around for a while?
Yeah. Yeah, the name had been around from when we first started this record. And the record is recorded chronologically, so the very first song we worked on was I’m Sensitive and the second was Tragic ALert, etc etc etc, til we got to the end where we were just wasted.
But the name... we’d already discussed it, me and Sammy. It’s just going to be the two of us, so lets go in there and take a very surgical approach, try and do really fast songs. There’s your methedrine reference, which.. I hate the fucking drug, by the way... and then... wait... I would rather rather tangle with a drunk fraternity guy, a linebacker, so to speak. 6’ 4” 250lbs, drunk at a fraternity party, than dealing with meth heads man! Methheads are really ridiculous; all they wanna do is like figure out an angle, thinking at super-fast speeds, to come rip off your wallet, or some shit like that, what can they get on you. That’s basically been my experience with methheads (laughs). It’s like the one drug I’ve never really got into. I did it once and I thought I was having a heart attack! So, we had the fucking Meth part down. We had the Surgical part down. And then at the end of it we looked back and outside of... I played all the guitars and bass on it but all the drums and samples and stuff like that were really Machine driven, so it just made sense to us. It wasn’t trying to be a trendy name or anything. It pretty much describes the recording process.
Thanks man! I think the reason it might be good is because it wasn’t supposed to be released or anything! It’s just people being themselves; me and Sammy. We didn’t really care because there wasn’t an agenda to it. We weren’t trying to release it or start a band or anything. It was just like... we were just working on ideas. I think that kind of fun comes through your speakers and the record when you listen to it, knowing that these aren’t just some douchebags with some pre-agenda-ed fashion statement or something. Its just like a couple of old white stoned dudes in the studio. And people seemed to like it. So good for them man. I’m happy for them.
Does that then mean you feel pressured when it comes to releasing Ministry or RevCo or whatever else you’re doing?
They’re already recorded dude! That what I keep telling ya. Every four months I just record a bunch of stuff. And at the end of those four months we go “you know what, that might sound good for a new Ministry direction or something. It sounds like Ministry”. Or “this song is stupid. We should put this on RevCo.” Or “you know what, Jello was here and he really liked this song we were working on, so we’ll put it on the Lard shelf”. So at the end of the day, I’ve got all these shelves full of stuff, at the end of the four months. And we don’t know what to do with them. This is the first time we just took the ideas and were coerced into releasing them as a single item. You know what I’m saying? Usually, that stuff goes to everywhere else... on whatever we feel it suits that particular “brand name”, if you will. So it’s... it’s kinda like an organic multi-corporation. If there’s such a thing. The whole way of recording like that is a paradox, because you are separating things into different... costumes, if you will... for other people. “Oh, that might sound like Ministry. Oh, that might sound like RevCo or whatever”. At the same time, you get some of these gems where we’re like, we don’t know what to do with the stuff. So it just winds up like that. And people hear it and then we release it and all hell breaks loose (laughs).
Right. So you never set out do do this as a two-man band. This is what you do all the time anyway. You just liked what you’d recorded and put it out.
You got it! You got it. That’s basically it. The funny part is it took us literally 40 hours to come up with a name after someone said they wanted to release it. We had absolutely no intention... not only with a band, or a release or a record contract or press or videos or anything like that. So we’re kind a like... we’re locked-in rock stars on this one man (laughs). Sorry (laughs). I wish I could give you a better story (laughs). That’s pretty much what happened.
You mentioned the name Surgical Meth Machine while you were in Australia early last year. So the idea had been around for a while?
Yeah. Yeah, the name had been around from when we first started this record. And the record is recorded chronologically, so the very first song we worked on was I’m Sensitive and the second was Tragic ALert, etc etc etc, til we got to the end where we were just wasted.
But the name... we’d already discussed it, me and Sammy. It’s just going to be the two of us, so lets go in there and take a very surgical approach, try and do really fast songs. There’s your methedrine reference, which.. I hate the fucking drug, by the way... and then... wait... I would rather rather tangle with a drunk fraternity guy, a linebacker, so to speak. 6’ 4” 250lbs, drunk at a fraternity party, than dealing with meth heads man! Methheads are really ridiculous; all they wanna do is like figure out an angle, thinking at super-fast speeds, to come rip off your wallet, or some shit like that, what can they get on you. That’s basically been my experience with methheads (laughs). It’s like the one drug I’ve never really got into. I did it once and I thought I was having a heart attack! So, we had the fucking Meth part down. We had the Surgical part down. And then at the end of it we looked back and outside of... I played all the guitars and bass on it but all the drums and samples and stuff like that were really Machine driven, so it just made sense to us. It wasn’t trying to be a trendy name or anything. It pretty much describes the recording process.
I saw you on stage in Melbourne last year, popping your front teeth out and fucking with the crowd. I assume the cover of the new album is your own dental x-ray? What was the idea behind that?
Yeah, absolutely! They asked if we had any artwork to do a cover... well, first they asked us if we had a name and we didn’t. and then they asked if we had any artwork and we didn’t. So I said yeah, I’ve got these... Hey Sammy, check these out! I’ve got these x-rays from my last dental check-up and he said Cool! So yeah, we used that as the album cover. Like I keep telling ya man, this shit isn’t thought out! It’s not high-brow shit. It’s just very low-brow. We just go with the flow. And it just happens to be that people picked up on it. And now, all of a sudden, we’re international pop stars or something! We didn’t fuckin’ know! (laughs).
Your cover of Devo’s Gates of Steel feels like it’s the transition between the two halves of the album. Were you always planning on doing a cover song? And how did you come to choose Devo?
Dude, we didn’t even plan on having an album, for starters! Second of all, yes! I’m very glad you picked up on the transition point of the record. Because that’s exactly what it was. So we started out going into the studio as we usually do, for four months. And just who ever’s there, like if Mikey was there when he was alive, he’d be there and Jello Biafra came in for a weekend. We just decided to go into the studio, get ideas out. So, we’re working on this stuff and then... in the middle of working on it, because there’s no deadline, we’re just doing ideas, I moved out to California. When I got out here, of course, I immediately got my medical weed card and my California driver’s license, which you need as ID, came in the day that we went into the studio and had no fucking ideas. None! None whatsoever! I said, what do you want to work on today Sammy? And he said, man, I got nothing. What about you? I got nothing. So I go, well, lets do a cover then, y’know. And I’m like, what would you like do? And he was like, Devo? And I’m like, Devo! Yeah! Yes, absolutely! So we just went into like ah... just because it was an off day in the studio. That one was not meant to be on the record at all and... there wasn’t meant to be a record!!
So the whole thing is really organic in that sense. It was kind of a lark that we decided like, OK, we have no ideas today, what do you wanna do? Well, lets do Devo. And so we did and that was it. I mean there’s no deep thought into the meaning or why. I mean, I always liked the song. I thought it was a really good punk anthem, only only it was done by a real... in a real quirky arty style. And I interpreted the thing as a punk anthem when I was a kid. And I’ve got to know the members over the years. The ones that are still alive anyways... and actually one dead one. So... we got to be friends and shit and that was just the first name that popped into my head when it’s like well, what do you want to do a cover of kinda thing. So... and Sammy’s like, yeah, I love those guys. So... either way... I mean, the whole thing was organic, it wasn’t planned out to be like “OK, we’re gonna do a cover” or “we’re gonna do a Devo cover” or even “we’re gonna do an album”, “we’re gonna be big... we’re gonna make a Surgical...” the whole thing was ridiculous. It’s pretty funny really (laughs).
It’s a great track and transitions the album nicely.
Yeah! The day we got our weed card, that’s when the album changed. Because we didn’t know it was going to be an album. So of course it changed, because all of a sudden we’re ordering weed from a fucking take-out place that comes every 20 minutes. And for the last half of that record, we failed miserably at making the fastest record in the world man (laughs). It was like, not even close! You know? We just gave up and rolled with the punches, if you will...
It sounds like you were having a lot of fun.
It was interesting. I mean, just... it’s only interesting now. At the time, it’s just what we usually do. We just go in and record and see what happens and then figure it out later. But this one was like, we did what we did and we thought we’d figure it out later but they made us figure it out sooner. So we just released what we did.
So the legal weed played a big part in the album. It’s good to see the progressive thinking of some of the States and their legalising of weed, both medical and recreational.
Well, that’s why you don’t need to worry about Trump and all these other whores coming out of America right now. There are enough stoned people right now with all the States that have legalised it, that we’re gonna make sure we keep the chill lid on what’s going on here, all right? So you folks down there, don’t worry about us spawning a Trump on you. It ain’t gonna happen. We just have to remember not to get too stoned on voting day and actually go vote (laughs). Other than that, you guys are safe.
Good to hear Al! I feel relieved. I watch the reports of what’s happening and wonder what the fuck’s going on!
Listen man, that’s the media manipulating you! It’s like, we no longer control computers. Computers control us. And media, being part of a computer, because they do data programming on likes and dislikes, like all your pop-ups on your laptop of whatever... they just figure out what we like and so, it’s an echo chamber, where you never get to progress or grow as a human being because you’re always listening to the same shit that you’d be interested in anyways, whether it’s music, news art or whatever. So we are programmed. So the computers have already won. Everyone’s saying oh, is there going to be, like, some robot wars in the future? And I’m like, there already is man (laughs). That’s another thing that this SMM record is about, you know?
Yeah, this Trump thing has been interesting to watch.
Don’t worry!!! I promise! Listen. Listen man, I’m not a betting man, ok? Gambling isn’t... It’s one of the faults that has passed me by. So, I don’t gamble. But... That being said, I guarantee you, the “Uncle Al Promise”; Trump will not be President. Nor will Cruz, nor will any right-wing douchebag after this election. I promise you that. So everyone Down Under can sleep well tonight, thanks to Uncle Al. Because I make that a solemn promise. So consider it done.
I feel better already!
(laughs)
Yeah, absolutely! They asked if we had any artwork to do a cover... well, first they asked us if we had a name and we didn’t. and then they asked if we had any artwork and we didn’t. So I said yeah, I’ve got these... Hey Sammy, check these out! I’ve got these x-rays from my last dental check-up and he said Cool! So yeah, we used that as the album cover. Like I keep telling ya man, this shit isn’t thought out! It’s not high-brow shit. It’s just very low-brow. We just go with the flow. And it just happens to be that people picked up on it. And now, all of a sudden, we’re international pop stars or something! We didn’t fuckin’ know! (laughs).
Your cover of Devo’s Gates of Steel feels like it’s the transition between the two halves of the album. Were you always planning on doing a cover song? And how did you come to choose Devo?
Dude, we didn’t even plan on having an album, for starters! Second of all, yes! I’m very glad you picked up on the transition point of the record. Because that’s exactly what it was. So we started out going into the studio as we usually do, for four months. And just who ever’s there, like if Mikey was there when he was alive, he’d be there and Jello Biafra came in for a weekend. We just decided to go into the studio, get ideas out. So, we’re working on this stuff and then... in the middle of working on it, because there’s no deadline, we’re just doing ideas, I moved out to California. When I got out here, of course, I immediately got my medical weed card and my California driver’s license, which you need as ID, came in the day that we went into the studio and had no fucking ideas. None! None whatsoever! I said, what do you want to work on today Sammy? And he said, man, I got nothing. What about you? I got nothing. So I go, well, lets do a cover then, y’know. And I’m like, what would you like do? And he was like, Devo? And I’m like, Devo! Yeah! Yes, absolutely! So we just went into like ah... just because it was an off day in the studio. That one was not meant to be on the record at all and... there wasn’t meant to be a record!!
So the whole thing is really organic in that sense. It was kind of a lark that we decided like, OK, we have no ideas today, what do you wanna do? Well, lets do Devo. And so we did and that was it. I mean there’s no deep thought into the meaning or why. I mean, I always liked the song. I thought it was a really good punk anthem, only only it was done by a real... in a real quirky arty style. And I interpreted the thing as a punk anthem when I was a kid. And I’ve got to know the members over the years. The ones that are still alive anyways... and actually one dead one. So... we got to be friends and shit and that was just the first name that popped into my head when it’s like well, what do you want to do a cover of kinda thing. So... and Sammy’s like, yeah, I love those guys. So... either way... I mean, the whole thing was organic, it wasn’t planned out to be like “OK, we’re gonna do a cover” or “we’re gonna do a Devo cover” or even “we’re gonna do an album”, “we’re gonna be big... we’re gonna make a Surgical...” the whole thing was ridiculous. It’s pretty funny really (laughs).
It’s a great track and transitions the album nicely.
Yeah! The day we got our weed card, that’s when the album changed. Because we didn’t know it was going to be an album. So of course it changed, because all of a sudden we’re ordering weed from a fucking take-out place that comes every 20 minutes. And for the last half of that record, we failed miserably at making the fastest record in the world man (laughs). It was like, not even close! You know? We just gave up and rolled with the punches, if you will...
It sounds like you were having a lot of fun.
It was interesting. I mean, just... it’s only interesting now. At the time, it’s just what we usually do. We just go in and record and see what happens and then figure it out later. But this one was like, we did what we did and we thought we’d figure it out later but they made us figure it out sooner. So we just released what we did.
So the legal weed played a big part in the album. It’s good to see the progressive thinking of some of the States and their legalising of weed, both medical and recreational.
Well, that’s why you don’t need to worry about Trump and all these other whores coming out of America right now. There are enough stoned people right now with all the States that have legalised it, that we’re gonna make sure we keep the chill lid on what’s going on here, all right? So you folks down there, don’t worry about us spawning a Trump on you. It ain’t gonna happen. We just have to remember not to get too stoned on voting day and actually go vote (laughs). Other than that, you guys are safe.
Good to hear Al! I feel relieved. I watch the reports of what’s happening and wonder what the fuck’s going on!
Listen man, that’s the media manipulating you! It’s like, we no longer control computers. Computers control us. And media, being part of a computer, because they do data programming on likes and dislikes, like all your pop-ups on your laptop of whatever... they just figure out what we like and so, it’s an echo chamber, where you never get to progress or grow as a human being because you’re always listening to the same shit that you’d be interested in anyways, whether it’s music, news art or whatever. So we are programmed. So the computers have already won. Everyone’s saying oh, is there going to be, like, some robot wars in the future? And I’m like, there already is man (laughs). That’s another thing that this SMM record is about, you know?
Yeah, this Trump thing has been interesting to watch.
Don’t worry!!! I promise! Listen. Listen man, I’m not a betting man, ok? Gambling isn’t... It’s one of the faults that has passed me by. So, I don’t gamble. But... That being said, I guarantee you, the “Uncle Al Promise”; Trump will not be President. Nor will Cruz, nor will any right-wing douchebag after this election. I promise you that. So everyone Down Under can sleep well tonight, thanks to Uncle Al. Because I make that a solemn promise. So consider it done.
I feel better already!
(laughs)
Back to SMM; the video for I’m Invisible came out last week. What was your reasoning for making a video for that particular track?
Well, we put it out on April Fools Day. Need I say more about it?
The song has a real cheesy, lounge type of feel to it. The images of Fremont, old Vegas, really suit it. What was the inspiration behind the clip?
Ahh, I would just say blame David Lynch and blame marijuana. There you go, those are the culprits, not me (laughs).
You’re wearing a gas mask in some shots. Any stories behind that mask?
I think it’s one I happened to buy when I was drunk one night at a truck-stop. I think I got it at a truck-stop in Germany or something. Then you wake up and there’s a gas mask in your bed. I’ve kinda hung onto it for a while. I never wore it so I figured... The label said we had to do a photo shoot and video and shit, so I thought all right, this would be a good time to try on is thing I’ve been lugging around for 8-10 years... That I bought at a truck stop. So... Let’s put on the gas mask. Why not? (laughs)
Do you have many souvenirs from your touring/travels that you’ve kept? Anything in particular that makes you smile when you think about it?
Well, actually... When I got divorced a couple of years ago, I think my ex-wife got everything. And for some reason I got to keep the gas mask. I dunno if it was in the contract (laughs). But either way, it ended up with me. But all the other stuff like that went to my ex-wife. I’m sure she’s ebaying and having a great time right now. But that’s the way it goes. The only thing I really managed to keep out of that divorce was... Well, the dental work I had in is still in there. So I still got my teeth. Other than that, I think she got everything else. Except for this fucking gas mask!
Just to touch on Ministry for a moment; I saw you play a bunch of shows last year. You seemed happy, healthy and having fun. Are you enjoying playing live shows now?
Well... Yes, and no. I mean, no in the sense that it’s kind of debilitative in the sense that... I like to keep going into the studio and creating new shit. As opposed to stopping everything you’re doing, having to do press, then going out on tour and recreating shit. To me... If I can go back and create shit, that would be a little bit better. And we try to do that to some extent, by providing visuals and things. And also learning alternative versions of songs that maybe fit the personnel and what we’re doing at the time a little bit better. But it’s still recreation to me. To me, going to a show to see your favourite hits with a bunch of, like, old white stoned dudes up there, is definitely worth saving your money on. Don’t go see that shit. Stay at home, get yourself some good weed, spark up a fattie, put on some headphones and crank that shit. And that’s a much better experience than going to see a band live. That’s the way I look at it. I consider it a complete... umm... Retroactive, retread kinda thing, to recreate an album live. I mean, you do the best you can, but it’s not one of my favourite things. However... As far as it looked like I was having fun and all that, I was. Because, for the first time, I reached that conclusion that this is just kind of a circus, that you might as well enjoy it, while you can, you know, while you’re on this planet. It is, it’s a circus man, because the real shit goes down in the studio. The live stuff, yeah, it’s fun. So yeah, for once, I was having fun up there.
The shows I saw were great. The band was sounding massive.
Well, we've had the same crew for eight to ten years. Same everything, these guys... We’re are all in it together. We don't hire hired guns. You've got to get into the family first. It's kind of a weird familial thing. But the same crew, same people. We've gone through our musicians over the years but it's been seamless. They are already with us in spirit for a year or two or three or four before. So transitioning from Raven to Tony on bass was no problem because we already knew Tony quite well, so he was part of the family. And now we are transitioning from Tony to Mandi (Martyr). And she’s literally part of the family, because she’s married to Aaron (Rossi), our drummer. So... It's really kept in-house. We don't go out hiring hired guns like all these bands that want reunion concerts or something. You’ve got like Alice Cooper on stage, who is in his late sixties and the rest of the band is in their twenties. So it’s like, no we don't float that boat. We just go with our own.
Well, we put it out on April Fools Day. Need I say more about it?
The song has a real cheesy, lounge type of feel to it. The images of Fremont, old Vegas, really suit it. What was the inspiration behind the clip?
Ahh, I would just say blame David Lynch and blame marijuana. There you go, those are the culprits, not me (laughs).
You’re wearing a gas mask in some shots. Any stories behind that mask?
I think it’s one I happened to buy when I was drunk one night at a truck-stop. I think I got it at a truck-stop in Germany or something. Then you wake up and there’s a gas mask in your bed. I’ve kinda hung onto it for a while. I never wore it so I figured... The label said we had to do a photo shoot and video and shit, so I thought all right, this would be a good time to try on is thing I’ve been lugging around for 8-10 years... That I bought at a truck stop. So... Let’s put on the gas mask. Why not? (laughs)
Do you have many souvenirs from your touring/travels that you’ve kept? Anything in particular that makes you smile when you think about it?
Well, actually... When I got divorced a couple of years ago, I think my ex-wife got everything. And for some reason I got to keep the gas mask. I dunno if it was in the contract (laughs). But either way, it ended up with me. But all the other stuff like that went to my ex-wife. I’m sure she’s ebaying and having a great time right now. But that’s the way it goes. The only thing I really managed to keep out of that divorce was... Well, the dental work I had in is still in there. So I still got my teeth. Other than that, I think she got everything else. Except for this fucking gas mask!
Just to touch on Ministry for a moment; I saw you play a bunch of shows last year. You seemed happy, healthy and having fun. Are you enjoying playing live shows now?
Well... Yes, and no. I mean, no in the sense that it’s kind of debilitative in the sense that... I like to keep going into the studio and creating new shit. As opposed to stopping everything you’re doing, having to do press, then going out on tour and recreating shit. To me... If I can go back and create shit, that would be a little bit better. And we try to do that to some extent, by providing visuals and things. And also learning alternative versions of songs that maybe fit the personnel and what we’re doing at the time a little bit better. But it’s still recreation to me. To me, going to a show to see your favourite hits with a bunch of, like, old white stoned dudes up there, is definitely worth saving your money on. Don’t go see that shit. Stay at home, get yourself some good weed, spark up a fattie, put on some headphones and crank that shit. And that’s a much better experience than going to see a band live. That’s the way I look at it. I consider it a complete... umm... Retroactive, retread kinda thing, to recreate an album live. I mean, you do the best you can, but it’s not one of my favourite things. However... As far as it looked like I was having fun and all that, I was. Because, for the first time, I reached that conclusion that this is just kind of a circus, that you might as well enjoy it, while you can, you know, while you’re on this planet. It is, it’s a circus man, because the real shit goes down in the studio. The live stuff, yeah, it’s fun. So yeah, for once, I was having fun up there.
The shows I saw were great. The band was sounding massive.
Well, we've had the same crew for eight to ten years. Same everything, these guys... We’re are all in it together. We don't hire hired guns. You've got to get into the family first. It's kind of a weird familial thing. But the same crew, same people. We've gone through our musicians over the years but it's been seamless. They are already with us in spirit for a year or two or three or four before. So transitioning from Raven to Tony on bass was no problem because we already knew Tony quite well, so he was part of the family. And now we are transitioning from Tony to Mandi (Martyr). And she’s literally part of the family, because she’s married to Aaron (Rossi), our drummer. So... It's really kept in-house. We don't go out hiring hired guns like all these bands that want reunion concerts or something. You’ve got like Alice Cooper on stage, who is in his late sixties and the rest of the band is in their twenties. So it’s like, no we don't float that boat. We just go with our own.
You posted a message after leaving Australia last year, saying that it won’t be another 20 years before you’re back. Is that still the case?
That’s true! Yeah, definitely. That’s definitely true. That one is as good as gold, as much as Trump won’t be President. I will be back in Australia within 20 years of leaving last time. I promise you that. But what band will it be? I don’t know. That’s the point. I don’t know. Because, like I told you, I’ve got about half a RevCo record, about half a Ministry record and about three quarters of a Lard record. So whichever one actually gets done first next time I go into the studio... We’ll finish that one off and maybe we’ll tour on that one. Because it is fun, you know? Once you realise the perspective of what it is that you’re actually doing and you can embrace that, then touring becomes more fun than having it just it be a stress ball and always being sick and all this other shit when you’re on the road. My health has totally improved since I had the last surgery and shit, so it’s all good. I mean, I would love to come down there and play. I am... I am having fun now. But there’s still better uses for your money than seeing a bunch of fat stoned old white guys up there (laughs) doing shit (laughs). I don’t know (laughs). I just find it dumb. I mean, spark up a fattie and listen to the record. LOUD!. And be with the people you like and just enjoy the record. The whole live thing, it still freaks me out. But at least I’m having fun with it now.
Well that’s the most important thing; that you’re having fun.
Yeah, I wouldn’t do it at this point in my life if it wasn’t fun. Anything. Whether it’s like a record or a tour, or anything else like that, if it’s not fun, blow it off man. It ain’t work your time. It really isn’t. A message to the kids now, growing up; if it ain’t fun, blow it off.
There you go kids, more words of wisdom from Uncle Al.
So, you mentioned a minute or so ago that you have some Ministry sitting on your studio shelf. Is that something you think you’ll release one day?
Well, right now I’m working with this guy called Arabian Prince, who was one of the original founding members of NWA. And some of the stuff that’s coming out of that is pretty whack man. It’s like, ahh... Lots of crazy-ass beats, and stuff like that going on, so we’ll see if that’s a new band or we’ll see if we incorporate that into SMM or whatever. Because the songs I have on the shelf for Ministry, the songs that are recorded, basically lend themselves to a Filth Pig or Dark Side of the Spoon vibe. There’s no thrash on there. There are a lot of dirges and stuff like that. So we’ve got about five or six songs of that. Then I’ve got Lard over there. We’ve got about seven songs that make a perfect follow up to the last Lard record. So we’ve got some good ones for that. That’s the closest one to being done. And we’ve got like five ideas on a RevCo record that are ridiculously bad stadium arena rock (laughs). So I’m kinda pursuing all three at once and we’ll see which one gets done first. But in the mean time, right now, I’m working with this guy on some total master beats, with a guitar flavour to it. So I’m doing guitar on a bunch of beats. Which as basically what I did on SMM. So I’m sticking with that for a while. We’ll see if it’s a new band or if it’s something else. I’ll figure it out later. So that’s what’s going on.
Wow! You have a lot going on. And you’ve released a lot of albums with different bands on various record labels over the years. Do you have any problems keeping track of who owns the rights to your various works?
Umm... until I was reminded, I didn’t even know, like I said, that this was going to be a record. So what I did 20 years ago (laughs) gets pretty difficult to remember sometimes (laughs). But ahh... You just keep going forward man. If somehow, some company or somebody, pays the rent so you have a roof over your head, and you have a studio to record in, it generally benefits the neighbourhood because because the crime rate goes down, because I have something to do. I just go out to the studio for 12 hours and the crime rate goes down. Otherwise I’d be a fucking nervous wreck, with bi-polar disorders and this and that. I mean, I’m a fucking psychological, neurological, physical mess! But! As long as I’m in the studio, I feel like I can walk upright. So it’s all good. I’d just like to stay there for the most part.
So recording ideas in the studio is your release.
Well, it’s either that or lead a life or crime! I just figure this is a better path to take (laughs).
That’s true! Yeah, definitely. That’s definitely true. That one is as good as gold, as much as Trump won’t be President. I will be back in Australia within 20 years of leaving last time. I promise you that. But what band will it be? I don’t know. That’s the point. I don’t know. Because, like I told you, I’ve got about half a RevCo record, about half a Ministry record and about three quarters of a Lard record. So whichever one actually gets done first next time I go into the studio... We’ll finish that one off and maybe we’ll tour on that one. Because it is fun, you know? Once you realise the perspective of what it is that you’re actually doing and you can embrace that, then touring becomes more fun than having it just it be a stress ball and always being sick and all this other shit when you’re on the road. My health has totally improved since I had the last surgery and shit, so it’s all good. I mean, I would love to come down there and play. I am... I am having fun now. But there’s still better uses for your money than seeing a bunch of fat stoned old white guys up there (laughs) doing shit (laughs). I don’t know (laughs). I just find it dumb. I mean, spark up a fattie and listen to the record. LOUD!. And be with the people you like and just enjoy the record. The whole live thing, it still freaks me out. But at least I’m having fun with it now.
Well that’s the most important thing; that you’re having fun.
Yeah, I wouldn’t do it at this point in my life if it wasn’t fun. Anything. Whether it’s like a record or a tour, or anything else like that, if it’s not fun, blow it off man. It ain’t work your time. It really isn’t. A message to the kids now, growing up; if it ain’t fun, blow it off.
There you go kids, more words of wisdom from Uncle Al.
So, you mentioned a minute or so ago that you have some Ministry sitting on your studio shelf. Is that something you think you’ll release one day?
Well, right now I’m working with this guy called Arabian Prince, who was one of the original founding members of NWA. And some of the stuff that’s coming out of that is pretty whack man. It’s like, ahh... Lots of crazy-ass beats, and stuff like that going on, so we’ll see if that’s a new band or we’ll see if we incorporate that into SMM or whatever. Because the songs I have on the shelf for Ministry, the songs that are recorded, basically lend themselves to a Filth Pig or Dark Side of the Spoon vibe. There’s no thrash on there. There are a lot of dirges and stuff like that. So we’ve got about five or six songs of that. Then I’ve got Lard over there. We’ve got about seven songs that make a perfect follow up to the last Lard record. So we’ve got some good ones for that. That’s the closest one to being done. And we’ve got like five ideas on a RevCo record that are ridiculously bad stadium arena rock (laughs). So I’m kinda pursuing all three at once and we’ll see which one gets done first. But in the mean time, right now, I’m working with this guy on some total master beats, with a guitar flavour to it. So I’m doing guitar on a bunch of beats. Which as basically what I did on SMM. So I’m sticking with that for a while. We’ll see if it’s a new band or if it’s something else. I’ll figure it out later. So that’s what’s going on.
Wow! You have a lot going on. And you’ve released a lot of albums with different bands on various record labels over the years. Do you have any problems keeping track of who owns the rights to your various works?
Umm... until I was reminded, I didn’t even know, like I said, that this was going to be a record. So what I did 20 years ago (laughs) gets pretty difficult to remember sometimes (laughs). But ahh... You just keep going forward man. If somehow, some company or somebody, pays the rent so you have a roof over your head, and you have a studio to record in, it generally benefits the neighbourhood because because the crime rate goes down, because I have something to do. I just go out to the studio for 12 hours and the crime rate goes down. Otherwise I’d be a fucking nervous wreck, with bi-polar disorders and this and that. I mean, I’m a fucking psychological, neurological, physical mess! But! As long as I’m in the studio, I feel like I can walk upright. So it’s all good. I’d just like to stay there for the most part.
So recording ideas in the studio is your release.
Well, it’s either that or lead a life or crime! I just figure this is a better path to take (laughs).
From a life of crime to being a super hero: I spoke to Burt from Fear Factory last year and we talked about his Industrialist graphic novel. You yourself were working on a comic, The Devils Chord, with Sam Shearon a while back.
Did anything come of it?
Well, Sam came by and did a bunch of sketches of me and ahh... We tried out my new super powers, that’s one of them. There’s a little indication on the SMM video of what my super powers are in this comic book. But my main power is that I’m able to hear conversations all over the fucking world. And then I can fly there and kick some arse with this nuclear powered Flying W guitar that I have, and knock down buildings and kill evil villains and all sorts of shit. I mean, I’m geared to go man! I’m ready. I’ve got super powers already. Did you see me fly on the last fucking video? C’mon man, I’m a super hero waiting to happen.
Yeah, we’ve always known you’re a super hero Al
Yeah (laughs). I’m just flexing my muscle now man. I’m just getting used to being a super hero. This might be fun (laughs).
Speaking of other activities... Outside of playing shows, do you ever get the chance to get out and see live music?
Well, you know what? I haven’t seen a show in probably three years! I think Burton coaxed me into going to see a Fear Factory show and I ahh... wound up getting thrown out of the venue. So they thought, and I’m thinking as well, that it’s a bad idea that I show up at live events any more, because I get so frustrated with what society’s become and I let people know that. And therefore I get in some sort of societal problems, if you will, every time I go out. So basically, the bands that play around here that are friends of mine, or that I’m interested in, wind up coming over to my place and we’ll hang out and shoot the shit. And that’s much preferable. And then I can listen to this stuff on headphones and get an essence of that aspect of them and then get to know them as people instead of going to see a show, if you know what I mean. I don’t want to sound elitist about it or anything, it’s just that I know that I’m just really tired of paying bail bondsmen whenever I go out (laughs).
And you moved to California a while back. Are you enjoying it there?
Yeah, of course man! Medical weed cards, it’s sunny every day, this n that... I’ve lived here previously. I did a two-year stint in, I think, 1985 and then I did another two-year stint in the year 2000. And I moved to Texas and now I’m back. So it’s just like fitting hand in glove man. And I’m back to where I probably should be.
Is it true you spend you days chasing kids off your front lawn?
Well yes, they are a problem. But they’re not near as bad as racoons! Which was a real pain the in ass to get out of my attic for two months (laughs). It took me everything... It took every last ounce of energy left in my bones to get rid of those fuckers! But these kids are easy to scare. I just go out there and just kinda yell a little bit and throw beer cans at them and they scatter pretty fast.
Well, no offence Al, but you’re a pretty scary looking bloke, so I assume they be pretty freaked out!
Well, I’ve learned my lesson. I don’t throw beer cans at anyone over 16. If they’re young kids, it’s just a warning shot (laughs). I don’t really wanna tangle with these youngsters with all their guns n shit, y’know? I just kinda hang out and chill and do my own thing. But these damn kids are tearing up my flower garden, so I go out and yell at them some times.
Kids these days! Ha!
When you were in Australia last year, you mentioned something about some acting roles. Did that happen?
Yeah, I just did one. It’s for a movie called... umm... ... ... The Black Room. That’s what it is. I’ve got this little walk on part where I wear this 1970’s kinda fuck me suit. And I’m in the middle of this satanic séance and the preacher is Arthur Brown from The Crazy World Of Arthur Brown in the 60s. And I’m like his right-hand man that gets him victims or whatever. And turn people to satanic practices. I’m in that scene. And at the end of the scene they have some prosthetic pack on me where my balls explode all over the ceiling and walls. So I die in the movie. After about five minutes of being annoyed by me, they kill me off by my balls exploding (laughs).
Ha! Awesome!
Dude! Stuart, I’m not making this shit up! That’s exactly what went down. And that movie is scheduled for release, of course, around Halloween. Late October. And Natasha Henstridge stars in it, the director is... umm... Rolfe Kanefsky... I don’t even know why I was there but it was fun while I was there. It’s like six hours of hanging out with crazy Arthur Brown and just being stoned and wearing really bad clothing (laughs). It was a great way to get paid! (laughs).
Did anything come of it?
Well, Sam came by and did a bunch of sketches of me and ahh... We tried out my new super powers, that’s one of them. There’s a little indication on the SMM video of what my super powers are in this comic book. But my main power is that I’m able to hear conversations all over the fucking world. And then I can fly there and kick some arse with this nuclear powered Flying W guitar that I have, and knock down buildings and kill evil villains and all sorts of shit. I mean, I’m geared to go man! I’m ready. I’ve got super powers already. Did you see me fly on the last fucking video? C’mon man, I’m a super hero waiting to happen.
Yeah, we’ve always known you’re a super hero Al
Yeah (laughs). I’m just flexing my muscle now man. I’m just getting used to being a super hero. This might be fun (laughs).
Speaking of other activities... Outside of playing shows, do you ever get the chance to get out and see live music?
Well, you know what? I haven’t seen a show in probably three years! I think Burton coaxed me into going to see a Fear Factory show and I ahh... wound up getting thrown out of the venue. So they thought, and I’m thinking as well, that it’s a bad idea that I show up at live events any more, because I get so frustrated with what society’s become and I let people know that. And therefore I get in some sort of societal problems, if you will, every time I go out. So basically, the bands that play around here that are friends of mine, or that I’m interested in, wind up coming over to my place and we’ll hang out and shoot the shit. And that’s much preferable. And then I can listen to this stuff on headphones and get an essence of that aspect of them and then get to know them as people instead of going to see a show, if you know what I mean. I don’t want to sound elitist about it or anything, it’s just that I know that I’m just really tired of paying bail bondsmen whenever I go out (laughs).
And you moved to California a while back. Are you enjoying it there?
Yeah, of course man! Medical weed cards, it’s sunny every day, this n that... I’ve lived here previously. I did a two-year stint in, I think, 1985 and then I did another two-year stint in the year 2000. And I moved to Texas and now I’m back. So it’s just like fitting hand in glove man. And I’m back to where I probably should be.
Is it true you spend you days chasing kids off your front lawn?
Well yes, they are a problem. But they’re not near as bad as racoons! Which was a real pain the in ass to get out of my attic for two months (laughs). It took me everything... It took every last ounce of energy left in my bones to get rid of those fuckers! But these kids are easy to scare. I just go out there and just kinda yell a little bit and throw beer cans at them and they scatter pretty fast.
Well, no offence Al, but you’re a pretty scary looking bloke, so I assume they be pretty freaked out!
Well, I’ve learned my lesson. I don’t throw beer cans at anyone over 16. If they’re young kids, it’s just a warning shot (laughs). I don’t really wanna tangle with these youngsters with all their guns n shit, y’know? I just kinda hang out and chill and do my own thing. But these damn kids are tearing up my flower garden, so I go out and yell at them some times.
Kids these days! Ha!
When you were in Australia last year, you mentioned something about some acting roles. Did that happen?
Yeah, I just did one. It’s for a movie called... umm... ... ... The Black Room. That’s what it is. I’ve got this little walk on part where I wear this 1970’s kinda fuck me suit. And I’m in the middle of this satanic séance and the preacher is Arthur Brown from The Crazy World Of Arthur Brown in the 60s. And I’m like his right-hand man that gets him victims or whatever. And turn people to satanic practices. I’m in that scene. And at the end of the scene they have some prosthetic pack on me where my balls explode all over the ceiling and walls. So I die in the movie. After about five minutes of being annoyed by me, they kill me off by my balls exploding (laughs).
Ha! Awesome!
Dude! Stuart, I’m not making this shit up! That’s exactly what went down. And that movie is scheduled for release, of course, around Halloween. Late October. And Natasha Henstridge stars in it, the director is... umm... Rolfe Kanefsky... I don’t even know why I was there but it was fun while I was there. It’s like six hours of hanging out with crazy Arthur Brown and just being stoned and wearing really bad clothing (laughs). It was a great way to get paid! (laughs).
Back to SMM again... All of the tracks have lyrics dripping with sarcasm... Except one... I Want More... It’s a very specific, angry song, isn’t it?
Ohohooooh! Oohhhh... Of course, it would only be an Aussie who picked up on that one!
Well, it was big news down here. Did you get a resolution to that?
No. He gets to run away with all the money for good. Because for me to chase it down for ten cents in the dollar through Australian courts, by the time I’d be done... Look, it’s not just me. It’s every band. And it’s not just every band! It’s the entire scene! What he did, it’s... I don’t care what he slags me about. Someone told me he’s all over the press saying I’m an asshole and I’m a crack addict and this and that, that I can’t even make it to stage... But I have a track record. My track record is I’ve missed one show in 33 years of touring. OK? So that’s my track record. His track record is fucking over bands for now going on a few years, taking next year’s revenue and playing last year’s bands because somewhere along the line, he got fucked and spent too much money, but still wanted to make his little festival go. And so he promises... He holds off the bands he’s supposed to pay and pays the bands for next year. So it’s like a Ponzi scheme. You understand what I’m saying?
People often wondered how long the festival could last.
Yeah, it’s unsustainable, including his own lifestyle, apparently. Using other people’s money to live... I mean, this is no dramatic news. This happens in the business world, especially in America, more often than not. So, it wasn’t a surprise. But what he has to understand is that bands... If you don’t send full deposits and shit like that, for bands to travel trans-continentally and get hotels and all that shit, it costs money man! I know everyone’s so used to getting everything for free; I’ll download it for free, I’ll get your magazine for free. I can download it. I don’t need to spend money. Everything’s free. Free, free, free, free, free. But people don’t realise... So it’s much bigger than that douchebag. It’s that people don’t realise that if you don’t support the arts, and you just want everything free, and then if you complain that the quality of the product coming out from the people who literally have to work two day jobs just to put a roof over their head because they’re artists. OK? But everyone wants it for free. So fuck you. This isn’t as good as the last record. Well guess what? These people have to work for a living because you get everything for free. It’s like this sated, fat, ugly... public... consumer market for music. And then they just complain that everything sounds the same. Now... you get what you... act for, basically. I mean, that’s their actions. So, in that sense, everyone wants something for free.
And then when you’ve got one promoter that just, like, well, I’m just taking care of me, nobody wins. The bands get ripped off. The people eventually get ripped of because the festival has to close because bands can’t afford to travel there any more. That’s a big thing, for bands to travel. You know what? Since everything’s free, the merchandise is bootlegged, the royalties are non-existent, because everyone just downloads it for free and all that... So the one chance to get to make up ground on the rest of the year, is to tour live. right? And when you get completely ripped off on touring live, it fucks you up man! I mean, I’m not like fucking rich or anything... It fucks you up! You feel it. It’s hurting! So all this shit he says about me being a drug addict and all that shit, I don’t really fucking care. You can point the mirror at me but I’ve never denied any of that shit. The point is, you fucked up man. You ripped off, not just me, but a lot of bands that count on that so they can continue to be artists. And that’s the big picture thing of this all that pisses me off. It’s not the small picture. It’s not that Ministry got ripped off. What he’s done means bands will think twice about going to Australia unless they have a reputable person that sends entire band money up front instead of just half or anything like that, and then leave them stranded there. You know what I’m saying?
Yeah, that’s the problem.
That’s my only beef with it. It’s not like it’s all about “Ministry’s broke; we need money”. It’s more about the entire big picture, the whole thing. Where bands are going to think twice. And that effects the public man. And the public’s gotta pony up too, because you can’t just expect to be getting good music for free all the time and you don’t support your local artists. I mean, there must be a way to balance that out, so artists that do good shit... And that way, it’s a consumer market. In a way, if you think abut it, it’s capitalism at it’s height. You decide what you want to put money up for and support that artist that floats your boat at that particular time. You can cut off the funds if they don’t float your boat and you’ve got a new boat to ride in. Fund that boat. But the point is, right now, everything’s free, free, free, free... And then you go and play and you get ripped off. So how are people supposed to create art under those circumstances?
What about crowdsourcing or pre-selling festival tickets?
Well here's the problem with that.. Who's going to do something that's going to happen in a year from now? And everyone is sitting on their money and actually expect that to happen. What he's done is given a bad name, taking money in advance ie ticket holders of Soundwave or whatever. I mean, it's just a miscarriage of trust. And of justice really, if you ask me.
Ohohooooh! Oohhhh... Of course, it would only be an Aussie who picked up on that one!
Well, it was big news down here. Did you get a resolution to that?
No. He gets to run away with all the money for good. Because for me to chase it down for ten cents in the dollar through Australian courts, by the time I’d be done... Look, it’s not just me. It’s every band. And it’s not just every band! It’s the entire scene! What he did, it’s... I don’t care what he slags me about. Someone told me he’s all over the press saying I’m an asshole and I’m a crack addict and this and that, that I can’t even make it to stage... But I have a track record. My track record is I’ve missed one show in 33 years of touring. OK? So that’s my track record. His track record is fucking over bands for now going on a few years, taking next year’s revenue and playing last year’s bands because somewhere along the line, he got fucked and spent too much money, but still wanted to make his little festival go. And so he promises... He holds off the bands he’s supposed to pay and pays the bands for next year. So it’s like a Ponzi scheme. You understand what I’m saying?
People often wondered how long the festival could last.
Yeah, it’s unsustainable, including his own lifestyle, apparently. Using other people’s money to live... I mean, this is no dramatic news. This happens in the business world, especially in America, more often than not. So, it wasn’t a surprise. But what he has to understand is that bands... If you don’t send full deposits and shit like that, for bands to travel trans-continentally and get hotels and all that shit, it costs money man! I know everyone’s so used to getting everything for free; I’ll download it for free, I’ll get your magazine for free. I can download it. I don’t need to spend money. Everything’s free. Free, free, free, free, free. But people don’t realise... So it’s much bigger than that douchebag. It’s that people don’t realise that if you don’t support the arts, and you just want everything free, and then if you complain that the quality of the product coming out from the people who literally have to work two day jobs just to put a roof over their head because they’re artists. OK? But everyone wants it for free. So fuck you. This isn’t as good as the last record. Well guess what? These people have to work for a living because you get everything for free. It’s like this sated, fat, ugly... public... consumer market for music. And then they just complain that everything sounds the same. Now... you get what you... act for, basically. I mean, that’s their actions. So, in that sense, everyone wants something for free.
And then when you’ve got one promoter that just, like, well, I’m just taking care of me, nobody wins. The bands get ripped off. The people eventually get ripped of because the festival has to close because bands can’t afford to travel there any more. That’s a big thing, for bands to travel. You know what? Since everything’s free, the merchandise is bootlegged, the royalties are non-existent, because everyone just downloads it for free and all that... So the one chance to get to make up ground on the rest of the year, is to tour live. right? And when you get completely ripped off on touring live, it fucks you up man! I mean, I’m not like fucking rich or anything... It fucks you up! You feel it. It’s hurting! So all this shit he says about me being a drug addict and all that shit, I don’t really fucking care. You can point the mirror at me but I’ve never denied any of that shit. The point is, you fucked up man. You ripped off, not just me, but a lot of bands that count on that so they can continue to be artists. And that’s the big picture thing of this all that pisses me off. It’s not the small picture. It’s not that Ministry got ripped off. What he’s done means bands will think twice about going to Australia unless they have a reputable person that sends entire band money up front instead of just half or anything like that, and then leave them stranded there. You know what I’m saying?
Yeah, that’s the problem.
That’s my only beef with it. It’s not like it’s all about “Ministry’s broke; we need money”. It’s more about the entire big picture, the whole thing. Where bands are going to think twice. And that effects the public man. And the public’s gotta pony up too, because you can’t just expect to be getting good music for free all the time and you don’t support your local artists. I mean, there must be a way to balance that out, so artists that do good shit... And that way, it’s a consumer market. In a way, if you think abut it, it’s capitalism at it’s height. You decide what you want to put money up for and support that artist that floats your boat at that particular time. You can cut off the funds if they don’t float your boat and you’ve got a new boat to ride in. Fund that boat. But the point is, right now, everything’s free, free, free, free... And then you go and play and you get ripped off. So how are people supposed to create art under those circumstances?
What about crowdsourcing or pre-selling festival tickets?
Well here's the problem with that.. Who's going to do something that's going to happen in a year from now? And everyone is sitting on their money and actually expect that to happen. What he's done is given a bad name, taking money in advance ie ticket holders of Soundwave or whatever. I mean, it's just a miscarriage of trust. And of justice really, if you ask me.
But in saying all that, you’re still not put off coming back to Australia?
No way! I'll be back. I just don't know whether I'll have a band with me. Or a show. But I'll be back (laughs). And if I do come back, I'll only do it if I know that I could do a really good show there for whatever band it is. And that we are paid appropriately. I don't ask for anything more than I what I know it's worth. And what I know the profit that they’re making. Make it appropriate. We’re all in this together man. That’s the thing. When people just start getting greedy, it gets really fucked up man. And... I don’t feel personally attacked by this guy or whatever, it’s just... Dude, you don’t get the big picture. The big picture is... Not only are promoters like that and bands themselves, just trying to make a quick buck, by trying to sound like everyone else that just sold records, for whatever reason. Not understanding that the reason they sell records is because they’re, like, promoted out of their fucking mind by whatever label and DJs bought off and friending and viral and this that and the other... But by not supporting artists, you’re really doing yourself a dis favour, not... The artists, of course, but you’re doing yourself a disfavour.
Perth gets left off a lot of tours When you make it back to Australia, will you visit us on the west coast?
Well, you know, I made it a specific point that last time we went there I wanted to play Perth. Because Perth is the site of one of the... Well, not one of, but the best show we ever did. For Ministry, that is. It was the 1995 Big Day Out in Perth. It was our last show on the Australian continent and that show was magical. And I’ve always wanted to go back to Perth. So I specifically asked for that. And Soundwave cancelled the Perth show! When we signed on to do Soundwave, they said we’d go back to Perth. So that’s another thing. I love Perth man! Are you fucking kidding me? That’s the first place I’ll go! If I go there without a band, just on vacation, that’s where I’m going.
I hear you’re not too good with cars on the opposite side of the road. You’d have to be careful with that!
Well I didn't say I was going to live there but I would definitely like to go there as long as I don't have to cross any streets by foot or by car. I'm good man, just carry me around like Queen Nefertiti on some kind of, like, stretcher or carry me around in a caravan because I cannot negotiate that. My brain does not function on that left right thing very well as opposed to other people. I lived in London for two years and I was hit by three cars, so I'm pretty wary about any left hand driving. It freaks me out now. I can't even get it together to cross the street in these places let alone drive. And that's a big thing now in Australia; foreigners come down there and drive and they windup hitting people! Because people get confused! My brain is amongst those that get very confused. I'm not wired for that. It just doesn't make sense to me. I constantly look the wrong way when I cross the street by foot. And like I said I was hit three times in two years in London had to be taken to hospital and shit. Just by trying to cross the road (laughs). To me it's a very dangerous place. But you know what an aphrodisiac danger is, so of course I'll be back (laughs).
So what have you been up to today Al?
Literally seven hours of press and that is about it. Now, you’re my last one today, so when I get off the phone, I will probably watch hockey and smoke pot. That seems to be the two things I do best (laughs).
I saw my first ever live hockey game late last year. It’s awesome!
Right?! The energy is just palpable man. It's awesome. I love going to these games. Actually you get to see, like, society in this controlled scientific experiment, with a hockey game. So I go there... I mean, I love hockey. I played it in high school. But the point is, I go there because I get to do a real sociological study. It's kind of like going to airport. You get to see all the different things. That's why airports don't bother me much because I just get to people watch. And that's the great thing about a hockey game. You get to see an environment that you’re not really accustomed to and you get to observe it. So I love going to the live games. If there's not one tonight, I'll have to watch it on TV. Either way, that's what I do to fuckin’ unwind and relax and shit like that.
OK, well, it’s been great talking to you Al. Thank you so much. I’ll let you get to your hockey game.
Awesome. My pipe is already lit (laughs). As we’re speaking (laughs). Take care man. Bye bye...
No way! I'll be back. I just don't know whether I'll have a band with me. Or a show. But I'll be back (laughs). And if I do come back, I'll only do it if I know that I could do a really good show there for whatever band it is. And that we are paid appropriately. I don't ask for anything more than I what I know it's worth. And what I know the profit that they’re making. Make it appropriate. We’re all in this together man. That’s the thing. When people just start getting greedy, it gets really fucked up man. And... I don’t feel personally attacked by this guy or whatever, it’s just... Dude, you don’t get the big picture. The big picture is... Not only are promoters like that and bands themselves, just trying to make a quick buck, by trying to sound like everyone else that just sold records, for whatever reason. Not understanding that the reason they sell records is because they’re, like, promoted out of their fucking mind by whatever label and DJs bought off and friending and viral and this that and the other... But by not supporting artists, you’re really doing yourself a dis favour, not... The artists, of course, but you’re doing yourself a disfavour.
Perth gets left off a lot of tours When you make it back to Australia, will you visit us on the west coast?
Well, you know, I made it a specific point that last time we went there I wanted to play Perth. Because Perth is the site of one of the... Well, not one of, but the best show we ever did. For Ministry, that is. It was the 1995 Big Day Out in Perth. It was our last show on the Australian continent and that show was magical. And I’ve always wanted to go back to Perth. So I specifically asked for that. And Soundwave cancelled the Perth show! When we signed on to do Soundwave, they said we’d go back to Perth. So that’s another thing. I love Perth man! Are you fucking kidding me? That’s the first place I’ll go! If I go there without a band, just on vacation, that’s where I’m going.
I hear you’re not too good with cars on the opposite side of the road. You’d have to be careful with that!
Well I didn't say I was going to live there but I would definitely like to go there as long as I don't have to cross any streets by foot or by car. I'm good man, just carry me around like Queen Nefertiti on some kind of, like, stretcher or carry me around in a caravan because I cannot negotiate that. My brain does not function on that left right thing very well as opposed to other people. I lived in London for two years and I was hit by three cars, so I'm pretty wary about any left hand driving. It freaks me out now. I can't even get it together to cross the street in these places let alone drive. And that's a big thing now in Australia; foreigners come down there and drive and they windup hitting people! Because people get confused! My brain is amongst those that get very confused. I'm not wired for that. It just doesn't make sense to me. I constantly look the wrong way when I cross the street by foot. And like I said I was hit three times in two years in London had to be taken to hospital and shit. Just by trying to cross the road (laughs). To me it's a very dangerous place. But you know what an aphrodisiac danger is, so of course I'll be back (laughs).
So what have you been up to today Al?
Literally seven hours of press and that is about it. Now, you’re my last one today, so when I get off the phone, I will probably watch hockey and smoke pot. That seems to be the two things I do best (laughs).
I saw my first ever live hockey game late last year. It’s awesome!
Right?! The energy is just palpable man. It's awesome. I love going to these games. Actually you get to see, like, society in this controlled scientific experiment, with a hockey game. So I go there... I mean, I love hockey. I played it in high school. But the point is, I go there because I get to do a real sociological study. It's kind of like going to airport. You get to see all the different things. That's why airports don't bother me much because I just get to people watch. And that's the great thing about a hockey game. You get to see an environment that you’re not really accustomed to and you get to observe it. So I love going to the live games. If there's not one tonight, I'll have to watch it on TV. Either way, that's what I do to fuckin’ unwind and relax and shit like that.
OK, well, it’s been great talking to you Al. Thank you so much. I’ll let you get to your hockey game.
Awesome. My pipe is already lit (laughs). As we’re speaking (laughs). Take care man. Bye bye...
Surgical Meth Machine is available Friday 15th April.
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